Dan Durston/Massdrop X-Mid

Discussion in 'Shelters & Accessories' started by theoctagon, Aug 3, 2018.

  1. FOX160

    FOX160 Thru Hiker

    A 10” bathtub floor be idle !
  2. dandurston

    dandurston Ultralighter

    Neat to be testing this out :)

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  3. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

    Drool! Want another tester?
  4. Micksjoiner

    Micksjoiner Trail Blazer

    what's the material and weight please.
  5. Jaco

    Jaco Trekker

    Ohhh, is this the eagerly-awaited semi-solid-single-inner? If it is, any chance it'll be available separately for existing 1P owners? :thumbsup:
  6. edh

    edh Thru Hiker

    Be interested to see testing feedback.
    I think some users in the UK believe that the US is just California and dry; yeah right....
    I've found the mesh to be good on the 1P, with about 5-6 weeks UK use.
    I like the solid material on my Notch Li, but for some reason the fabric feels wet to the touch even when dry?
    Good luck with the continuing development of the product line.
  7. Lempo

    Lempo Thru Hiker

  8. Cranston

    Cranston Thru Hiker

    An alluring hint of Bell Bottoms Dan. Nice!
    Last edited: May 10, 2021
  9. MyHatGandhi

    MyHatGandhi Trail Blazer

    Been reading through all 68 pages of this thread over the past 3 days, some really good information about mods etc... and the changes to the X-Mid over time is interesting.

    I've bought the 2P but want to change the guylines so they are longer. What is the consensus diameter for the 2P?
    I can see that Dan says 2.5mm is best based on testing (I'm inclined to go for 2.5mm like I have on my Trailstar), but has anyone had any luck with 2mm?

    The guylines from eBay last year wasn't great quality, so looking for some 2.5mm recommendations. I really like the braided rope recommended in a different thread (English braids one), but can't see 2.5mm there, which is why I'm asking about 2mm.

    Might go for Lawson's 2.5mm but seems quite expensive.
  10. dandurston

    dandurston Ultralighter

    We use 2.5mm now and it holds extremely well (to about 65 lbs versus about 30 lbs for a typical 2.5mm + LL3 setup). However, it doesn't slide quite as smoothly in the tensioners at 2.0mm. Arguably 2.0mm might be better since it's still plenty strong, holds well, lighter, and slides a bit nicer.

    I have also tested Lawson's cord in 2.0 and 2.5mm sizes. His cord is stiffer/denser so his 2.5mm acts thicker than our stock cord (and is ~50% heavier). The 2.5mm works, but it's really getting too thick for the tensioners and sometimes behaves a bit funny as it doesn't quite fit into the notch. Whereas his 2.0mm cord works great. Very similar to the stock 2.5mm in all regards (weight, holding power) but with the added perk of being lower stress for less deflection in high winds and snow loads.
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  11. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

    Instead of using 2.5mm cord use 1-1.25mm dyneema cord with a clamcleat line lock guy runner https://www.cleats.co.uk/browse-by-product/line-lok-guy-runners.html That’s what a couple of us have done. I did the same on my Notch Li https://blogpackinglight.wordpress.com/2021/05/04/notch-li-mods/ You actually save a bit of weight.
    Last edited: May 12, 2021
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  12. Lempo

    Lempo Thru Hiker

  13. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

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  14. Lempo

    Lempo Thru Hiker

  15. Robert P

    Robert P Section Hiker

    I've used 1.5mm polyester wrapped dyneema cord with mini line locs for the X Mid apex tie outs:

    I notice the link above for the 1.25mm cord states that it can slip in mini line locs, though @Robin may have practical experience that is not the case?
    I do recall reading that it is a good idea to have polyester wrapping rather than pure dyneema cord when using the mini line locs. But I'm fairly sure I used pure dyneema on the apex tie outs with mini line locs on a Notch without problems...
  16. MyHatGandhi

    MyHatGandhi Trail Blazer

    Thanks for this information Dan. Very interesting and informative. I'm less worried about the weight of the guylines, and a bit more focused on the availability and ability to withstand the Welsh winds.

    But it's great to hear that in some circumstances a 2mm might be an option.

    I think I might experiment with some 2mm lines and feedback.
  17. MyHatGandhi

    MyHatGandhi Trail Blazer

  18. MyHatGandhi

    MyHatGandhi Trail Blazer

    I read the same concerns about Dyneema, but I'm also curious about the slippage.

    I feel am experiment coming on. I'm willing to drop a few £££ for science.
  19. dandurston

    dandurston Ultralighter

    I think you'll find 2.0mm in the LLL's (as opposed to LL3's) is fantastic. I don't have my testing results handy, but the LLL's are much stronger than LL3's (they break around 60kg versus 25 kg) and 2.0mm Lawson cord holds to about 30-40kg as I recall. So you're getting higher holding power than 2.8mm in LL3s (which would break before 35-40 kg) yet still have a good safety margin before you break the LLLs.

    Note that all the above relates to the 10mm size of the LLLs. The 15mm size behaves much closer to LL3s in all regards.
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  20. MyHatGandhi

    MyHatGandhi Trail Blazer

    I did read your initial results (re 10mm "LLL"), but this just adds value to what I already read. I wasn't sure I initially understood but now it's a bit more clear. I'm going to try a few 2mm options and feedback based on my own testing. What I'm really keen on is the Lawson 2mm Vs English Braids 2mm holding power.

    Anyway, I set up the 2P for the first time today, I normally use a Trailstar, but the X-Mid was by far the easiest to set up. It just worked without the need for any thinking. No surprise to you I suppose, but kudos.
    dandurston likes this.
  21. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

    Never been a problem so far. Colin Ibbottson uses them on the Tramplite shelter. He was an aerospace engineer and everything he makes is high spec and well researched. Try some yourself. They are impossible to shift.
    Robert P likes this.
  22. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

    Yes instead of. Works like a conventional guy line runner

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  23. Robert P

    Robert P Section Hiker

    Thanks - good to know that 1.25mm line is fine in practice, could trim a little more weight!

    I'd used the 1.5mm line because I'd tried to replicate the apex tensioner on my Tramplite and that looks the same (and it was Colin's comment about 100% dyneema that I recalled):


    I'd just noticed mention of slipping wrt the 1.25mm line:

  24. Mole

    Mole Thru Hiker

    10 years ago or so, I used 1.5mm dyneema core line (the black White stuff that backpackinglight.co.uk used to sell) with these sort of lineloks on my Scarp pole guys.
    After a very windy TGO (2011) and the next winter, the line started slipping in the linelocs.
    It had worn a groove in the V and no longer gripped. Only apparent when windy - the lines kept slacking off.

    Changing up to a slightly thicker line 1.8 or 2mm this has never occurred again. ( The worn lineloks were replaced)

    Used in a different context than with a bouncy hoop pole this groove wearing may not happen.
    Robert P likes this.
  25. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

    It’s possible the Ebay stuff might slip as I’ve not tried it yet. It’s useful for other things so not critical.

    The Extremtextil stuff certainly doesn’t. If anyone is ordering so can they add me in!
    Robert P likes this.

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