New 3-season quilt?

Discussion in 'Sleeping Bags & Quilts' started by Erik Haaland, Sep 10, 2018.

  1. Erik Haaland

    Erik Haaland Summit Camper

  2. oreocereus

    oreocereus Ultralighter

    I stopped using (and really informing myself) about down a few years ago, so others will surely have stronger opinions. One of the things I’ve lovex about apex is not losing loft and thus warmth in multi day damp hikes (from humidity or condensation). If hydrophobic down works the same, is safe/heathy/environmentally friendly (i have no idea, but you mentioned a dislike of chemicals so I assumed the concerns were around this?) I’d go for it.
    There did seem to be some debates a few years ago as to how effective it actually was, so further reading might be good.

    Though I noticed the Gramxpert -6 apex quilt is about the same weight as the cumulus 450 bag... :whistle: but I understand a bag might be preferable (I’m actually weighing up both the Gramxpert and cumulus option for a 3+ season/mild winter bag).

    Édit: realised tou were looking at the 450 quilt, not bag. Presume the weight savings here are reasonable.
    Arne L. likes this.
  3. ZenTrekker

    ZenTrekker Ultralighter

  4. Erik Haaland

    Erik Haaland Summit Camper

    They charge 45 euro extra for this. I was thinking maybe just buy NikWax Down Wash Direct and do it myself, but NikWax replied me that (naturally) a treatment of feathers to industrial standards are better than after treatment.
  5. DuneElliot

    DuneElliot Ultralighter

    I thought the Nikwax was for washing only...I don't think it works like you are talking about doesn't add the hydrophobic quality to the down, but does help maintain it.

    You do realize that all modern gear ie not wool, linen, cotton etc is a made with chemicals so the little amount of chemical added to the HPD isn't going to make a huge difference.

    Personally, in a damp climate, I think it is absolutely the way to go.
    Erik Haaland likes this.
  6. Enzo

    Enzo Thru Hiker

    45 is quite a lot. I guess if you only use it in freezing conditions.... I wouldn't discount apex. I pretty much exclusively use synthetic jackets
  7. Enzo

    Enzo Thru Hiker

    If the hpd is nikwax I wouldn't consider wax a chemical to be concerned about.
  8. Erik Haaland

    Erik Haaland Summit Camper

    Cumulus get their feathers from Animex, the largest down factory in Poland. Animex have not responded to my question on the type of DWR treatment they use.
  9. WilliamC

    WilliamC Thru Hiker

    I've had quilts with untreated down and with treated down. To be honest, I haven't really noticed a difference. A good dwr on the shell probably makes a bigger difference, at least when the quilt is relatively new. Treated down might save the day if you have an accident.
  10. ZenTrekker

    ZenTrekker Ultralighter

    The only time I ended up with wet down was when I took a lightweight mummy sleeping bag and a RAB top bag in conditions that were too warm. I ended up sweating like a pig and I also had loads of condensation in my cheap tent. Both bags were soaked in the morning. After that experience I changed to a quilt and have never looked back.
    Marco, WilliamC and Erik Haaland like this.
  11. Teepee

    Teepee Thru Hiker

    Concur with Williamc. A good DWR on the shell is worth more than hydrophobic down, and that shell being highly breathable is a massive bonus. To have Hydrophobic or not really isn't an issue for me personally, I've never seen much of an improvement in performance.

    Down gets a bad rap really doesn't like to get wet; hydrophobic or not.....but, you really have to be doing something quite wrong to get it wet anyway.

    This vid always entertains me;

    Note how the bag is brand new, and the guy gets told not to move. :)
    Once that bag gets used, some body oils and dirt in the shell, it's not going to float as well.

    FWIW, I go camping in the hills more than anyone I know, mostly use a down bag, hardly ever use a shell or any cover on it, and have never even seen the need to add some Nikwax.
    gixer, Marco and WilliamC like this.
  12. Erik Haaland

    Erik Haaland Summit Camper

    I never got a reply on my email to them for the "custom" order with hydrophobic down so went ahead and ordered the standard 450 quilt in size medium. 209 euros (no VAT outside E) but there will be added VAT and handling fee in Norway so appx. 281 euros in total is my guess.
    WilliamC and Teepee like this.
  13. dovidola

    dovidola Section Hiker

    Sounds like a good choice!
    Erik Haaland likes this.
  14. ZenTrekker

    ZenTrekker Ultralighter

    I checked with Cumulus yesterday and it does seem that hydrophobic down is an additional charge.

    This was their reply "The cost of change of down to a hydrophobic one depends on the model and it is 1euro for each 10g."
    Erik Haaland likes this.
  15. FOX160

    FOX160 Thru Hiker

    It’s been said in the past by others that it works out around an extra 50 euros
  16. FOX160

    FOX160 Thru Hiker

    Wouldn’t suggest trying that in a quilt mind.
    Teepee, gixer and Erik Haaland like this.
  17. humankeith

    humankeith Backpacker

    Have you looked in to Katabatic Gear Erik? I’m just about to order one and from my research they seem to be the best.
  18. gixer

    gixer Thru Hiker

    I don't camp out much, certainly not as much as Mr Teepee, he probably camps out more in 1 month than i do in 1 year

    BUT i have had a instance where there was a bit of a disaster

    Strong winds, driving rain meant the doors on my tent wouldn't close
    Had about 1 hour total of driving rain inside the tent to the point where the bathtub actually started to behave like a bathtub

    I got inside my sleeping bag wet, the wind and rain made sure thew outside got wet
    Must have been around 3c

    My sleeping bag (PHD Minim 350, -2c rating) was wet through
    Still it kept me warm throughout the night

    Granted it probably wouldn't have done as well a second night if it was stuffed inside a rucksack wet
    But then how many of us are out in the wild to the point where we are unable to bailout or find a cabin the 2nd night after a disaster like that.
    FOX160, WilliamC and Teepee like this.
  19. Teepee

    Teepee Thru Hiker

    Bathtub groundsheets.....never viewed the same after you've had an unintended bath in one whilst out on a hillside :)

    Even quite wet, down filled insulation is usually far better than nothing. It's when it's been packed, completley saturated or had the air squeezed out of it and it clumps that it truly approaches useless.

    I'll never forget the night someone on here got his down underquilt completely drenched after a spring sprang up in the night running through the tarp. Another waking up after a horrific storm in the 'Gorms and not feeling right..stretching out in the morning and feeling water under under my feet ( the loch had flooded, that was an important lesson for me) .
    Erik Haaland likes this.

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