Meats & cheeses - protein sources for multi day hikes

I wonder how i managed a half marathon without eating any carbs for the previous week and then going for a walk the next day followed by a week of physical graft?

And the plant, roots nuts etc is speculative..
Did the early hunter gatherer expend energy foraging for nuts , leaf and berry or go for the biggest kill he could find or the bighest scavange he could steal...realizing a belly full of meat and fat would last him alot longer than a belly full of lime leaf and blackberries ...and the fruits nuts and leaves would have been high up due to the animals being taller and eating all in reach and having bigger bellies...
Now im the one being speculative lol.
Enjoy yer veg ...:D

Well - each very much to their own - but i won't be dropping by for a smooch - that's for sure :biggrin:

There is (unsurprisingly) quite a lot of 'he' going on in that discourse ..

Evidence suggests that it was most often the women folk doing the day to day foraging for plant foods, in co-operstive groups, whilst they cared for the youngsters too.

The hunting for additional protein - to give nutritional advantage to the tribe was done by menfolk on the whole - young men in particular with their high levels of testosterone, and need to prove themselves - being willing to take on the risks - but they were at the same time relatively expendable - they didn't carry or nuture the offspring for years - then when we settled to agriculture - we stopped hunting antelope so much - so maybe that's why we had to start up warmongering instead - to protect our silos of grain or pinch other peoples - now we do it over commodities such as oil - or land - but it all amounts to the same fairly basic preservation of me and mine , instinct perhaps.

Some anthropologists even liken the modern day fascination with tribal sports such as football, as being a psychological substitute for the antelope hunt - with all its excitements, and team alliances, and winning the goals.

Thank you, I do enjoy my veg - very much so - in myriad rainbow variety and delicious abundance - i can't imagine life without them .

https://www.instagram.com/p/BkSsLDPggYX/?taken-by=vegetable_dalliance

Some say i look rather well on it - not that outward appearances are of primary concern. :rolleyeses:

But my poor twenty five year old son was mistaken for my 'boyfreind' in a dress shop the other day - what horrors for him - it maybe his luxuriant beard that adds the years .. :o o:

That'll learn him to persuade me to go frock shopping - its a very lovely mustard and yellow floral - if you're interested ..

p.s. my very Yorkshire granny did the best ever puds - served as you suggest in the time honoured fashion, before the Sunday beef - served with lots, and lots, and lots of veg from grandfathers market garden - balance in all things :angelic:
 

EM-Chiseller

Thru Hiker
Goody gum drops and the picture looks divine...hardest part of this way of eating is not foraging as i go , not having a swill when i get back and the fact that a week before i embarked on this...i discovered the joy of beetroot with spinich for the 1st time in my life....

Well see where i am in 60 days..

Cheers an may the harvest of your efforts be bountiful and lasting....
There ...a peaceful almost hippie carnivore lol.
PEACE
 

Enzo

Thru Hiker
Well the proof is in the pudding.
##The most sensible strategy IMO is to minimise the amount of processed food you eat, to make sure you’re getting the right combination of nutrients and to ensure the bacteria in your gut has enough green veg to work on.##
This sounds very sensible to me.
Nutrition science seems miles away from being able to make any definitive statements, best source I've found is https://www.bookdepository.com/The-...px0U-fpdK-GO6TvfsBXpGZMiZ5AYrZcRoCbvMQAvD_BwE
Its actually based on objective facts and reason, rather than the usual new age hoowy.
Re carnivore diet, check out the native people in northern Siberia, no veg or starches, pretty much marine mammal fat. Turns out its full of vitamins, very low cancer and heart problem rates. Awful child mortality but that's due to the environment.
I heard an interview with a psychiatrist who worked in a specialist eating disorder clinic. She had treated most of the Instagram 'clean eating' stars. The whole thing sounds totally pathological to me.
 

Robin

Moderator
Staff member
I shan’t be writing a book on curing baldness! I don’t suppose it will go back to being luxuriant but it does make me wonder whether this diet might have slowed down hair loss.

The reason I read “Genius Foods” was principally because I became intetested in the link between dementia and diet. Our next door neighbour has Alzheimer’s. Max Lugavere’s mother suffered from Alzheimer’s too. Max has a journalism background rather than medical and sought out all the research he could find after drawing a blank with his mother’s medical team. For the book he had help from Paul Grewal a medical specialist in the field.

It’s a really good book for a non-specialist audience, referencing a lot of recent research on diet and brain function as well as how to change your diet. There appears to be quite a lot of evidence for brain inflammation and cognitive deterioration resulting from excessive gluten and sugar intake as well as misguided cholesterol reduction regimes.

The real eye opener is if you start to look at the food available in the aisles at the supermarket through this lens. A good 90% of them are heavily processed and often full of gluten and sugar. The easiest way to avoid overdosing on gluten and sugar is to avoid processed food as much as possible, especially wheat based products. It’s actually not too difficult to do.

Of course there’s no 100% guarantee of avoiding dementia but there’s no harm in stacking the odds in your favour. All I can say is that I feel healthier for dramatically reducing my gluten and sugar intake.
 

Robin

Moderator
Staff member
Well the proof is in the pudding.
##The most sensible strategy IMO is to minimise the amount of processed food you eat, to make sure you’re getting the right combination of nutrients and to ensure the bacteria in your gut has enough green veg to work on.##
This sounds very sensible to me.
Nutrition science seems miles away from being able to make any definitive statements, best source I've found is https://www.bookdepository.com/The-...px0U-fpdK-GO6TvfsBXpGZMiZ5AYrZcRoCbvMQAvD_BwE
Its actually based on objective facts and reason, rather than the usual new age hoowy.
Re carnivore diet, check out the native people in northern Siberia, no veg or starches, pretty much marine mammal fat. Turns out its full of vitamins, very low cancer and heart problem rates. Awful child mortality but that's due to the environment.
I heard an interview with a psychiatrist who worked in a specialist eating disorder clinic. She had treated most of the Instagram 'clean eating' stars. The whole thing sounds totally pathological to me.


I might get that book :thumbsup:
 

Enzo

Thru Hiker
Evidence suggests that it was most often the women folk doing the day to day foraging for plant foods, in co-operstive groups, whilst they cared for the youngsters too.

The hunting for additional protein - to give nutritional advantage to the tribe was done by menfolk on the whole - young men in particular with their high levels of testosterone, and need to prove themselves - being willing to take on the risks - but they were at the same time relatively expendable - they didn't carry or nuture the offspring for years - then when we settled to agriculture - we stopped hunting antelope so much - so maybe that's why we had to start up warmongering instead - to protect our silos of grain or pinch other peoples - now we do it over commodities such as oil - or land - but it all amounts to the same fairly basic preservation of me and mine , instinct perhaps.

Forgive me for parroting bits of Bret Weinstein lectures, but he has a bit about democratizing the different wisdoms evolved by women and men, a lot of which revolves around the different reproductive strategies open to them. Its interesting, to me anyhow.
 
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Robin

Moderator
Staff member
@Enzo bought it on Kindle. Lugavere’s book majors on the gut biome too. The gut has a big influence on brain function.
 
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Evidence suggests that it was most often the women folk doing the day to day foraging for plant foods, in co-operstive groups, whilst they cared for the youngsters too.

The hunting for additional protein - to give nutritional advantage to the tribe was done by menfolk on the whole - young men in particular with their high levels of testosterone, and need to prove themselves - being willing to take on the risks - but they were at the same time relatively expendable - they didn't carry or nuture the offspring for years - then when we settled to agriculture - we stopped hunting antelope so much - so maybe that's why we had to start up warmongering instead - to protect our silos of grain or pinch other peoples - now we do it over commodities such as oil - or land - but it all amounts to the same fairly basic preservation of me and mine , instinct perhaps.

Forgive me for parroting bits of Bret Weinstein lectures, but he has a bit about democratizing the different wisdoms evolved by women and men, a lot of which revolves around the different reproductive strategies open to them. Its interesting, to me anyhow.

Don't wish to be picky here Enzo.. But if you're going to quote me could you do it in "quotes"
;)
 

MartinK9

Section Hiker
My low carb adventure is due to my diabetes, Going against the NHS eatwell plate and my diabetic Nurses wishes....

So, less than 100 carbs per day, no root veg, no pasta, rice, bread or normal milk. Fruit is measured in single digits, berries only no tropical stuff.

Two years in my diabetes is in remission with my Blood sugar levels pre-diabetic levels and I don't miss the crap I used to eat.
 

DuneElliot

Section Hiker
Everything in moderation.

And we are NOT carnivores, we are omnivores...the evolution of our teeth and the length of our intestines shows that, if nothing else. Even bears eat berries and fruits and grass as well as meat...with black bears fruits and bugs and leaves are their primary food source.
 

Enzo

Thru Hiker
Heard a discussion re vegans and what they should feed their cats. Cats are obligate carnivores, I didn't know that, as @DuneElliot says the length of your gut is critical, cats have short guts because its easy to get what you need from meat. Bit disturbing to hear people prepared to make their pets very Ill in order to try and be consistent with their veganism. Just get a pet rabbit instead. Of course the hard core considered any keeping of pets as exploitative, showing a total lack of understanding of evolutionary biology.
 

fluffkitten

Moderator
Staff member
Everything in moderation.

And we are NOT carnivores, we are omnivores...the evolution of our teeth and the length of our intestines shows that, if nothing else. Even bears eat berries and fruits and grass as well as meat...with black bears fruits and bugs and leaves are their primary food source.

Think the majority of animal might be omnivores, even sheep are known to eat birds eggs. :D
 

Robin

Moderator
Staff member
Interesting quote from “The Diet Myth” (thanks @Enzo): “Several studies have shown that the fewer fruits and vegetables and fibre you consume, the less diverse your microbiome...” . Given that a lack of gut biome diversity causes all sorts of health issues, maybe a meat only diet is not advisable for an extended period. A simple way to boost your gut biome diversity is through full fat natural yoghurt and unprocessed soft cheeses along with green veg. I’m going to add some soft cheese into my diet. Another interesting snippet is that getting enough vitamin B12 is difficult if you don’t have the occasional serving of red meat.
 

dovidola

Thru Hiker
This discussion strikes me as one which most people in the world over the course of the last few thousand years would find somewhat baffling.

We have unprecedented choices in the Western World today about what we put in our mouths, whereas for the main part of our history, and in parts of the world still, there was/is only one choice, viz: eat it or die. A standard supermarket shopping basket contains an array of goodies which the Emperors and Kings of bygone years would have struggled to match.

I find some of today's dietary pernicketiness to be somewhat extreme, self-indulgent, and in poor taste...

...with one exception: over-processed highly 'manufactured' foods, about which I think it's reasonable to feel concerned, because these might well prove 'foreign' to our digestions, given that we've not evolved being exposed to such foods.
 

Clare

Thru Hiker
Interesting quote from “The Diet Myth” (thanks @Enzo): “ A simple way to boost your gut biome diversity is through full fat natural yoghurt and unprocessed soft cheeses along with green veg.

Kefir has many multiples of bacteria compared to yoghurt. I started making my own after an extended period on antibiotics messed up my digestion/wiped out my biome. It’s a white lumpy culture that looks a bit like cauliflower florets. Just add milk, wait a few days, strain and repeat. The culture grows and then you give away lumps of it to all your friends. It’s more sour than yoghurt but I like that. Delicious with honey and walnuts.


https://www.doctorshealthpress.com/food-and-nutrition-articles/kefir-vs-yogurt-which-one-is-better/
 

Enzo

Thru Hiker
1532195694979776248712.jpg

You can go too far with fermented foods.... From Sandor Katz's excellent 'the art of fermentation', another I first heard on r4

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08xxfz5
There could be a heritable component in what diets will work for you, obvious example is lactose tolerance, a mutation that stopped the mechanism that shut off the lactose enzyme after nursing finished. Ony~5000 years ago. I said heritable rather than genetic because you get your gut starter from your mum/ environment and perhaps if uoud been born in siberia your gut is all set for carnivore diet?
@Chiseller I recommend s faecal transplant of first nations poo o_O

I'd get it checked first though, the guy who oversees that part of Russia was one of the agents who murdered Litvinenko with polonium.
 

Robin

Moderator
Staff member
Well the proof is in the pudding.
##The most sensible strategy IMO is to minimise the amount of processed food you eat, to make sure you’re getting the right combination of nutrients and to ensure the bacteria in your gut has enough green veg to work on.##
This sounds very sensible to me.
Nutrition science seems miles away from being able to make any definitive statements, best source I've found is https://www.bookdepository.com/The-...px0U-fpdK-GO6TvfsBXpGZMiZ5AYrZcRoCbvMQAvD_BwE
Its actually based on objective facts and reason, rather than the usual new age hoowy.
Re carnivore diet, check out the native people in northern Siberia, no veg or starches, pretty much marine mammal fat. Turns out its full of vitamins, very low cancer and heart problem rates. Awful child mortality but that's due to the environment.
I heard an interview with a psychiatrist who worked in a specialist eating disorder clinic. She had treated most of the Instagram 'clean eating' stars. The whole thing sounds totally pathological to me.

Just finished The Diet Myth. Excellent book. Given me a few ideas like cheese, kefir and introducing a bit more variety in fruit and veg. Fortunately I’m doing a lot of what he suggests. The biggest worry is the section on antibiotics and to a lesser extent pesticides. It’s a shame there wasn’t a section on natural additives like Turmeric. Thanks for suggesting
 
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